date

1819 Apr. 4. To Erskine 5 III. Whig
1819 Apr. 4.

To Erskine 5 III. Whig demerits

Fallacies

1 Glorious Revolution

They would proceed to give us to understand /assure us/ that though /when/ our ancestors at that period, were well aware of the full-right of the people, to have resettled the whole frame of their Constitution", "they were enough" - and it was the result of their wisdom - to leave every thing untouched, which in principle and effect had not failed, and to provide only for the emergency of a vacant, or forfeited throne, by adhering as closely to antient inheritance as the security of the Constitution would admitt". Of their wisdom, yes: for of that sort of wisdom by /with/ which men have been said to be wise in their own generation - the existence of this sort of wisdom there can be no doubt in the instance /situation/ of those our wise ancestors, than in that of their no less wise successors.

Proceeding to insinuate and steal a misrepresentation upon misrepresentation - delusion upon delusion, they would proceed to assure as that "An alledged defect in this great work, so often in the mouths of Revolution, the sober-minded Whigs of England consider as decisively characteristic of its wisdom. "The people (they would instances) The people at large were not called upon to act for themselves as of the whole frame of the antient Government had been dissolved; but write "(they would say) were sent to the Convention Parliament to supply the single defect which (says your Lordship this in Statute) had taken place"
Similar Items
  • Title: [1819 Apr. 4 To Erskine 6 IV Whig Demerits]
    Description: 1819 Apr. 4

    To Erskine 6 IV Whig Demerits

    Fallacies

    1 Glorious Revolution

    They would this insinuate - with the contrary so full as[?] [...?] knowledge - they could this insinuate that we - the people and in particular such of the people of Westminster as with [...?]ly are 'Revolutionists' - that we want a Revolution: while the truth is, as is so well known to them that we want not any thing that ever has been, is with any propriety be designated by any such name as /the name of/ Revolution: and thus the only thing /change/ which when applied to this country has ever born that name is the change which we regard with disgust, because it would not answer /serve/ but counteract our purpose - and which /for the abovementioned reasons/ they have regarded and may at all times be justly considered regarding with complacency, because it would answer their purpose:

    They would this cause it to be believed that it is among our wishes that "the people at large" should be "called upon to act for themselves, as of the whole frame of the Government had been dissolved"; whereas so far from its being our wish to see the whole frame of the Government, antient or modern, dissolved, a result by which we ourselves should together with our adversaries be involved in one complet and common ruin, it is not part of our wish that the people at large should ever be called upon to act for themselves. In regard to Government our wish is that the people [...?] should act for themselves: but that they should always to wit in the House of Commons have their Agents to act for them: only /but/ that these Agents should be thus our deputies or delegates call them which you please - Agents appointed by their alledged principals and constituents - not

    by
  • Title: [1819 Apr. 5 To Erskine 10 III. Whig]
    Description: 1819 Apr. 5

    To Erskine 10 III. Whig demerits

    Fallacies

    1. Glorious Revolution

    Whatsoever you wish people to believe if it be true assert it, if false insinuate it: for by [...?] in the effort [...?] emmence[?] falshood save itself from [...?]

    They would proceed to observe that those "most virtuous and best informed amongst the higher and enlightened classes of the people, who [...?] took prudent and effectual steps for securing its success without bloodshed": they would this endeavour to cause it to believe that in seeking reform, reformists would rather the business should be done by bloodshed than without it.

    They would proceed to observe that those same Whigs of 1688 were confident of the support of a vast majority of the people: of all indeed, who loved freedom and detested [(+)] arbitrary power. They would pretend[?] to /and/ say /exclusive/ These were the Whigs of England at the Revolution;" and to add "and I have never till very lately, heard theor representatives decendants and representatives, whilst they maintained the principles of their forefathers, considered as an unprincipled faction in the state." They would thus endeavour to cause it to be believed that what ever was good in these principles in which every thing was good is maintained by themselves the Whigs of 1819: and that therefore as the appellation of an unpincipled faction in the state, would /could/ not be applied with propriety to these same forefathers, so neither could it be the present /existing/ descandents of those same forefathers.

    Well my Lord, now we are come again to those same paw-paw[?] words unprincipled faction. Well my Lord I am glad we are so [...?] to /it is quite pleasant to/ shake hands. No they shan't be called /nobody shall call them/ an unprincipled faction. My bond first: and whoever those were that ever ewre naughty enough to use such words they shall all join with me in the bond. But good as Sancter would say, are good here desire another: and as Lord North said, the reciprocity must not be all on one side. To make the whole matter, before I have done, I think to present /submitt/ to your

    Lordship

    Lordship a few queries. When those qwueries have received an answer from Your Lordship, the [...?] of attack and defence is cloud[?], and as Blackstone says, every thing is as it should be.

    [(+)] p. 4
  • Title: [1819 Apr. 4 To Erskine 8 IV. Whig]
    Description: 1819 Apr. 4

    To Erskine 8 IV. Whig Demerits

    Fallacies

    1 Glorious Revolution

    They would proceed to observe (+) that "in this manner England preserved all the antient measures of her freedom": and thereupon that "her laws and Constitution continued un[...?] they would thus endeavour to cause it to be believed that if the votes of those whose wishes are thus signified in appearance were really free, there would in England be no freedom

    They would proceed to observe that under that same arrangement all England's Laws and Constitution continued unshaken. They would thus endeavour to make us believe, that on that occasion no English law was shaken, taking care on other occasions to mention it as matter of merit that some laws were not only shaken but abolished: and thus on the present occasion should those votes which are pretended to be free be so in reality not only those laws by which such freedom is at present excluded would be abolished or changed, but all that is good in the Constitution destroyed.

    They would proceed to observe (++) that on that same occasion a principle of mutual obligation was solemnly established between the title of the sovereign and the stipulated rights of the people. They would thus endeavour to cause it /make us /men// to be believed not only that at that time that principle of obligation which they say was then established was sufficient for the securing of good government of government having for it end the greatest happiness of the greatest number but that it continues in a state of sufficient with reference to that same purpose even at this present day.

    (+) p. 3.4.

    (++) p. 4