date

5 Apr. 1808 Eldon's Bill Ch
5 Apr. 1808

Eldon's Bill

Ch.3. diver[...?]

13. To his Commissioners alarm, [...?] not to the Courts of Session, the learned scrobe gives his requisitorial authority, treated as it is. In any view of the matter whatsoever may to the facts necessary to serve as grounds for legislation, information touching their facts, and consequently all means necessary for the obtainment of that information in a compleat[?] as well as correct shape; the same are no less necessary to one set of initiative /initiating/ legislators than to another; not less to these when authority is confined to the suggestion of preferred laws. /Ch. │ │ supra/ My reasons for this opinions will occupy part of the chapter last spoken of.

14. In conformity to usage, as well as in my humble conception to propriety, the authority which the learned scribe gives for enquiry he gives to a Board, in contradistinction to an individual or one or more persons /individuals in greater number/ acting singly. But to the persons to whom he confesses[?] the authority for enquiry, he confirms, (with the exception of the Court already and all along in possession of legislation power though subordinate) the authority, and with it all encouragement for the suggestion of regulations. In my view of the matter on the present occasion in particular, neither Faculty for this purpose nor encouragment ought to be withholden from any individual in when[?] instance it can be expected to operate. The grounds of the opinion with an idea of the sort of encouragement that seem[?] [...?] to the nature of the case, will occupy a distinct Chapter. /+Ch │ │ Encourage Alternative[?] suggestions./
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  • Title: [5 Apr. 1808 Letter V Ch.3.]
    Description: 5 Apr. 1808

    Letter V

    Ch.3. [...?]

    11. In addition to the Commissioners to whom authority, co-extensive or nearly so with the whole field of procedure was given for the proposal of amendments /emendatory reputations/, and for ascertaining by enquiry the [...?] on which, as in their laws, their regulations even to rest[?], the learne scribe had [...?] his original Bill provided for the appointment of a distince set of Commissioners, when labours even to be confined to the plennary[?] a system of Jury Trial to be engrafted onto whatsoever system of procedure might have been planned or be about to be planned by the principal set of Commissioners. At the instance of the Faculty, by whom this superfactation[?] was disapproved of, it has in the learned scribe's amended Bill been given up. Of this after-birth, though abortion, the anatomy may afford matter perhaps for a Chapter by itself. /Ch │ │ Great [...?] Jury Trail Commissioners./

    12. To the authority given to his two sets of Commissioners for the ascertainment of the necessary facts, the learned scribe does not in either of his Bills add so much as a particle of [...?] power, for securing either the [...?] of the veracity and then the correctness of whatever information may happen to be obtained. The Faculty having in this point left him at liberty and without guidance, the same importance attaches upon his last as upon his first endeavours. My reasons for regarding truth, and the reasons necessary to the obtainment as being a basis no less necessary to for legislations than to Judicature, will ' occupy a separate Chapter. /Ch. │ │ Power for procuring[?] the information is indispensible./ /+Whatsoever evidence /information/ may be /cause/ to be obtained by the exercise of the valued authority [...?] with power is [...?] valued to be at once incorrect and incompletely [...?] in better [...?], fallen away./ The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth is In description of the sort of service /information/ which with indisputable prosperity is required at the hands of a [...?] from whom /when called upon for the/ information of that sort which is wanted[?] to form a basis for judication.
  • Title: [9[?] Apr. 1808 Letter V Ch]
    Description: 9[?] Apr. 1808

    Letter V

    Ch. 3 [...?]

    2. In regard to the Court of Justice, two Bills bearing the name of the Lord President formed together the basis, as already observed of the two Bills bearing the name of the Lord Chancellor. The Lord President's learned suit was for giving every [...?] that could be given, as well as leaving every thing /[...?]/ that could be left, to the Court so worthily presided /to a Court so happily in its President/. In his first Bill the Lord Chancellor's learned scribe exhibited no other wish. +On the part of the Faculty[?] of Advocates, the disposition manifested, in regard to that great judicial body, the body with which their acquaintance was so intimate, was to give to it nothing which it was possible not to give, to leave to it nothing which it was possible not to leave. [great judicial with which their acquaintance was so intimate.] Considerations of the most forcible nature concerned impress /in impressing/ upon my soul a distrust no less [...?] /[...?] of confidence/ that that which has been since declared by the Faculty of Advocates. The grounds of that distress will occupy a separate Chapter. +Ch. these are for distrusting the Court of Justice.

    3. In perseverance[?] of this confidence the Lord Chancellors learned scribe excepted out of the authority of the Commissioners and therein out of the consideration of Parliament the consideration of the quantity of time which after the intended separation of the Court of Justice /distribution of the 15 Judges/ into two divisions should be applied by them respectively to the discharge of the duties of their office: securing[?] that quantity against [...?] giving to then at the same time such power as would have them at liberty to subject it to that diminution the eventual necessity of which had as their Memorial been aforesaid: The Faculty having declared against the [...?] projected discrimination, the Lord Chancellor's learned scribe in his amended Bill gives up the point: +securing and secure against discrimination the number of days at present given to official duty in the Inns House: [...?] can at the same time by a new proviso to reserve the power of increase /this[?] when the declared object was discrimination the/, which then Under the circumstances of [...?] [...?] [...?] deficiency of laws[?] for [...?] of business.

    from first to lase my wish has been to see the road to increase open, and consequently this point included along with the rest in the authority given to the Commissioners. The road to discrimination is, if either, the road whch would have been barred by me. The grounds of this wish are disguised to occupy another Chapter. Ch + [...?] attendance ought not to be in [...?] [...?] that same Chapter.
  • Title: [18 Feb y 1808 on Lord Eldon's Bill]
    Description: 18 Feb y 1808

    on Lord Eldon's Bill

    Letter V

    '. 2 Course taken by the Bill - another proposed.

    Such being the contents of the Bill - such the Lord Chancellor's learned Draughtsman's plan for the reformation of Scottish judicature, I proceed[?] to submitt to Your Lordship my own humble conceptions, concerning the general [...?] and time[?] of [...?] course that appear to have been the General design and [...?] that appear to have been pursued in it. contrasting with the view which the same subject would have presented to my own unlearned eyes: after which, I propose to pursue the examination of it through the several parts of it; as above distinguished.

    The course pursued by the learned Draughtsman is this.

    1. In the first place come in terminus a set of regulations propozed to be established in these same[?] times, in the usual mode[?] by a direct exercise of the authority of Parliament.

    2. In the next place came a set of promises[?], the occupied business of which as to give to the Court of Session powers of subordinate legislation of the most ample extent covering /powers in extent so ample as to tower/ the whole field of judicature: powers in effect heaving[?] within that field no other [...?] than what are not by those by which the judication of the Court itself is circumscribed, together with the few [...?] comprized in the Parliamentary regulations just mentioned.

    3. In the third place came the portions of authority given to the [...?] set[?] of Commissioners: authority for proposing to Parliament regulations extending over a field of legislation co-existive in the main /for the most part/ with that which is submitted to the power of the Court of Session, as above: in the main, but not exactly; faling short of it in some points, in other points outstretching it: for enquiry, for collecting information, an authority co-existive as it as fit to be, or mainly so, with the field of inchoate legislative authority /field marked out as above as the sort of authority/ to the exercise of which the unquestioned[?] authority was necessary: authority, say; [...?] as to the power which was necessary to the correctness of the body of information [...?] for, every thing[?] of this sort has somehow or other been[?] omitted.