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[129b-410]
17 March 1817
Plan Cat
2 o
Introd
§.80. Seat Traffic
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Superseded but consultable
{On the occasion of the seat-traffic business A o 1809 To the eyes of M r /the head/ Speaker of Honourable House the subject presented itself in a different point of view {from that which is given here}. Content[?] {was to} that those who had nothing to offer /give for a seat/ but money should not be able to purchase it in any way neither by an express contract nor by an implied one. His only anxiety was not those who had office to give should not be able to purchase it by an implied act: i.e. {the only one of the three[?] media[?] in which it is customary or necessary to do the business Lest by implication over coming the his declared reluctance “to mix in the debates”, + once and again did he stand up and insist that to the prohibition should be attached the limitation conveyed by the word express. Lest in the prohibition put by the Bill implied
contracts should in this case be considered as included By the /these/ two short and unpremeditated speeches of the 7 th of June, an interpretation and that one unquestionable may be seen put upon the long and elaborate one of the 1 st.
“A Bill for more effectually preventing the sale of seats for money; and for promoting a monopoly thereof to the Treasury by the means of Patronage. Such was the title moved for by Lord Folkestone Out of 161 28 voted for this amendment. Cobbets debate June 13 th 1809.}
+ Speech 1 June 1809 Cobbets Debate
Similar Items
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Title: [[129b-411] 16 Mar. 1817 Parl]Description: [129b-411] 16 Mar. 1817 Parl Cat 2 o Introd §.{8. Freedom of Suffrage} 10 Seat Traffic 5 p 1015 Inserendum? {These things considered, anxious to secure themselves /itself/ against all hazards, with no less frankness than prudence, the Tories, taking the matter out of the hands of the Whigs, manufactured A o 1809 that Act /49 G.3.c./ by which the moneyed men with their money /men with money in their hands/ being with the most elaborate industry endeavoured to be drawn out of the market, the faculty and by means of that exclusion the monopoly /exclusive faculty/ was expressly reserved /reservation was made/ to the C – r General whose means of purchase are for the most part not in money but in moneys worth: expressly and by the very word express: for when as in other part of the Act proposition /the proposition/ was made to include in the description of the prohibited contract as well the case in which the agreement was implied as that in which it was express the word express was upon a division put in, and the word implied put out. So that in this particular the sense of Parliament was on that occasion not merely by implication but in express terms and by the word express declared That to the frankness by which this proceeding stands characterised the good quality of uniformity might be added an amendment it appears was moved by L d Folkestone to the title: an amendment in virtue of which instead of standing as at present the title would have stood thus. An Act for more effectually preventing the sale of seats for money: and for promoting a Monopoly thereof to the Treasury by the means of Patronage. [+] The improvement which would thus have been made was however rejected by a majority of 133 to 28: this being the case the design thus pursued is not to be found announced in the title of the Act, nor at any less expence than that of trailing[?] through /poring over/ the body of it: but it can not be too faithfully or carefully registered in the memory and in the hearts of the people.} [+] Cobbet’s Debates Jun 13 th 1809. Vol. XIV p.1015.
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Title: [[129b-440] 16 March 1817 2]Description: [129b-440] 16 March 1817 2 o Introd §18 Defence suffrage Seat Traffic 1 In The other reason which contributed to render him thus anxious to give admission to this protecting word express has something rather remarkable in it “This species of traffic whether carried on by implied or express covenants was an offence against the law of parliament, and in his opinion punishable as a misdemeanor at common law. If this was a sufficient reason for excluding from the operation of penalty the case of an express comment it should not one should have thought have been an equally sufficient reason for excluding from it the case of an implied covenant: yet some time or other by the Right Honourable Gentleman this application of it was not made. When a mischief which it is not convenient to the Honourable Gentlemen Eminently convenient and not a little employed is the recourse afforded on such occasions by Common Law. Statute law has determinant words to it and these words can not always without such sacrifices of characters as Honourable Gentlemen are not without necessity disposed to make be on every occasion /where/ be evaded. Common Law has no determinate words belonging to it: it is on most occasions exactly what the gentlemen in question please. Proportioned to the impossibility of error for where there is no standard there is no error is the degree of confidence with which when convenience invites /calls/ gentlemen take upon themselves to declare the tenor of that of which the essential character consists in its not having any tenor: if upon trial in due form so it happens the tenor assigned
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Title: [[129b-449] 2 May 1817 Plan]Description: [129b-449] 2 May 1817 Plan Cat Note Introd §18. Interests adverse Constitution Speakercraft {364} 5 Not employed As for the suspicion here manifested it is one which consistently with any sincere regard for the small remnant of liberty still left could not on such an occasion as the present be dissembled. As to the grounds of it they have though dispersedly been already brought to view: in general terms the extraordinary measure /degree/ of appropriate active talent as well as of appropriate intellectual aptitude applicable ad libitum so conspicuous in the quarter from whence the danger comes conjoined with the so unhappily and equally notorious hostility to /as towards/ the only remedy: the price which in the article of reputation in so far as concerns appropriate probity (understood always in the sense in which probity is understood by swinish multitude) this too real representative of the pretended representative of the people has been content to pay for the faculty of employing his power and his talents in this disastrous work. 1. On the occasion of the Debate in seat traffic going out of his way for the purpose of denouncing as enemies to the Constitution all persons /those/ by whom the only remedy, to the corruption against which for form sake he was inveighing, had been or could be supported + 2. On the occasion of the Bill for the suppression of such traffic the extraordinary and but too successful pains taken to save the corruption /corrupt traffic/ from the prohibition in question the corrupt traffic in the case of its being carried on by the Ministers of the Crown from that prohibition which was extended to all other cases / to save from prohibition /that corrupt traffic/ in the only case in which it is mischievous that corrupt traffic from that prohibition which he was employing himself in attaching to it in the cases whereof if not absolutely, it is comparatively, not to say absolutely, it has been shewn to be innoxious.
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